Post by Senbecc on Apr 8, 2006 4:50:20 GMT -5
I've been asked,
"Who / what are the 'the daughters of Ibhor'?"
That question has a long answer and a short answer.
A short answer is that the "daughters of Ibhor" are types of wisdom as
symbolized by the serpent.
The longer answer follows:
First, there are two episodes in BETHU BRIGTE (Author: [unknown]) at www.ucc.ie/celt/published/T201002/text001.html. These are examples of how the priests and poets synchronized the ancient Irish gods with the new religion of Christianity. Some have called this process "baptizing the fairies." This is early Christian propaganda that addresses the role of Druids and of Brighid, the Wisdom Goddess:
11
On another occasion after that an old pious nun who lived near Dubthach's house asked Brigit to go and address the twenty-seven Leinster saints in one assembly. It was just then that Ibor the bishop recounted in the assembly a vision which he had seen the night before. ‘I thought’, said he, ‘that I saw this night the Virgin Mary in my sleep, and a certain venerable cleric said to me: ‘This is Mary who will dwell among you’.’ Just then the nun and Brigit came to the assembly. ‘This is the Mary who was seen by me in a dream.’ The people of the assembly rose up before her and went to converse with her. They blessed her. The assembly was held where now is Kildare, and there Ibor the bishop says to the brethren: ‘This site is open to heaven, and it will be the richest of all in the whole island; and today a girl, for whom it has been prepared by God, will come to us like Mary.’ It happened thus.
My comments:
[Here, the old woman represents a cailleach if not the Cailleach. The number 27 is the cycles (houses) of the Moon. The sacred spot in Kildare is the sacred place of Brighid. The girl who comes to the Irish like Mary is obviously the Mother of the gods (in Christian guise and spin). Ibor the bishop is perhaps the Dagda in Christian clothes. The daughter of Ibor would then be Brighid through his act of recognition and blessing. On Brighid's day the chants are remembered and go thus (as found at
www.smo.uhi.ac.uk/gaidhlig/corpus/Carmina/M70.html ]:
From the Carmina Gadelica:
'Moch maduinn Bhride,
Thig an nimhir as an toll,
Cha bhoin mise ris an nimhir,
Cha bhoin an nimhir rium.'
(Early on Bride's morn
The serpent shall come from the hole,
I will not molest the serpent,
Nor will the serpent molest me.)
'La Feill na Bride,
Thig nighean Imhir as a chnoc,
Cha bhean mise do nighean
'S cha dean i mo lochd.' Imhir,
'La Fheill Bride brisgeanach
Thig an ceann de 'n chaiteanach,
Thig nighean Iomhair as an tom
Le fonn feadalaich.'
'Thig an nathair as an toll
La donn Bride,
Ged robh tri traighean dh' an
Air leachd an lair.' t-sneachd
(The Feast Day of the Bride,
The daughter of Ivor shall come from the knoll,
I will not touch the daughter of Ivor,
Nor shall she harm me.
On the Feast Day of Bride,
The head will come off the 'caiteanach,'
The daughter of Ivor will corne from the knoll
With tuneful whistling.
The serpent will come from the hole
On the brown Day of Bride,
Though there should be three feet of snow
On the flat surface of the ground.)
The 'daughter of Ivor' is the serpent; and it is said that the serpent will not sting a descendant of Ivor, he having made 'tabhar agus tuis,' offering and incense, to it, thereby securing immunity from its sting for himself and his seed for ever.
'La Bride nam brig ban
Thig an rigen ran a tom,
Cha bhoin mise ris an rigen ran,
'S cha bhoin an rigen ran rium.'
(On the day of Bride of the white hills
The noble queen will come from the knoll,
I will not molest the noble queen,
Nor will the noble queen molest me.)
More comments:
[This is obviously a carry over of serpent worship among the Irish and Gaels and is remarked as such by Alexander Carnichael in his notes and those presented at the URL.]
12
Another time thereafter she wished to visit her mother who was in slavery in Munster, and her father and fostermother would scarcely allow her to go. She went however. Her mother was at that time in ... engaged in dairy work away from the druid, and she was suffering from a disease of the eye. Brigit was working in her stead, and the druid's charioteer was herding the cattle; and every churning she made, she used to divide the produce into twelve portions with its curds, and the thirteenth portion would be in the middle and that was greater than every other portion. ‘Of what advantage to you deem that to be?’, said the charioteer. ‘Not hard’, said Brigit. ‘I have heard that there were twelve apostles with the Lord, and he himself the thirteenth. I shall have from God that thirteen poor people will come to me one day, the same number as Christ and his apostles.’ ‘And why do you not store up some of the butter?’ said the charioteer, ‘for that is what every dairy-worker does.’ ‘It is difficult for me’, said Brigit, ‘to deprive Christ of his own food.’ Then baskets were brought to her to be filled from the wife of the druid. She had only the butter of one and a half churnings. The baskets were filled with that and the guests, namely the druid and his wife, were satisfied. The druid said to Brigit: ‘The cows shall be yours and let you distribute the butter among the poor, and your mother shall not be in service from today and it shall not be necessary to buy her, and I shall be baptized and I shall never part from you.’ ‘Thanks be to God’, said Brigit.
My comments on this:
[The parallels between the Moons of a year are pretty obvious here as well, especially in the 12/13 portions of the churning of milk (in Vedic myth,this churning is the way in which creation and life began). Brighid is fulfilling her function and giving prosperity while she is doing it, yet nothing is diminished by the action. The roles of master/servant are reversed here with the Druid and Brighid, yet it is obvious that the Druid in the end yields to Sovereignty and Her Prosperity.]
Ibor is also a name for the Yew Tree in Old Irish and Gaelic. As such it is a symbol of recurring rebirth and ongoing life in cycles. In my opinion, Ibor is another name for the Dagda and his daughter the serpent is Brighid, Goddess of Wisdom. The name Ibor can be found as Ibhor, Ibar, Ibhar, Iomhair, and perhaps Iubhar in Irish and Gaelic tales.
There are also parallels between serpents, nagas, nathair, nathracha, and the children of Danu in both Vedic and Irish Celtic mythology. That's a posting for another day however,
-Searles O'Dubhain
"Who / what are the 'the daughters of Ibhor'?"
That question has a long answer and a short answer.
A short answer is that the "daughters of Ibhor" are types of wisdom as
symbolized by the serpent.
The longer answer follows:
First, there are two episodes in BETHU BRIGTE (Author: [unknown]) at www.ucc.ie/celt/published/T201002/text001.html. These are examples of how the priests and poets synchronized the ancient Irish gods with the new religion of Christianity. Some have called this process "baptizing the fairies." This is early Christian propaganda that addresses the role of Druids and of Brighid, the Wisdom Goddess:
11
On another occasion after that an old pious nun who lived near Dubthach's house asked Brigit to go and address the twenty-seven Leinster saints in one assembly. It was just then that Ibor the bishop recounted in the assembly a vision which he had seen the night before. ‘I thought’, said he, ‘that I saw this night the Virgin Mary in my sleep, and a certain venerable cleric said to me: ‘This is Mary who will dwell among you’.’ Just then the nun and Brigit came to the assembly. ‘This is the Mary who was seen by me in a dream.’ The people of the assembly rose up before her and went to converse with her. They blessed her. The assembly was held where now is Kildare, and there Ibor the bishop says to the brethren: ‘This site is open to heaven, and it will be the richest of all in the whole island; and today a girl, for whom it has been prepared by God, will come to us like Mary.’ It happened thus.
My comments:
[Here, the old woman represents a cailleach if not the Cailleach. The number 27 is the cycles (houses) of the Moon. The sacred spot in Kildare is the sacred place of Brighid. The girl who comes to the Irish like Mary is obviously the Mother of the gods (in Christian guise and spin). Ibor the bishop is perhaps the Dagda in Christian clothes. The daughter of Ibor would then be Brighid through his act of recognition and blessing. On Brighid's day the chants are remembered and go thus (as found at
www.smo.uhi.ac.uk/gaidhlig/corpus/Carmina/M70.html ]:
From the Carmina Gadelica:
'Moch maduinn Bhride,
Thig an nimhir as an toll,
Cha bhoin mise ris an nimhir,
Cha bhoin an nimhir rium.'
(Early on Bride's morn
The serpent shall come from the hole,
I will not molest the serpent,
Nor will the serpent molest me.)
'La Feill na Bride,
Thig nighean Imhir as a chnoc,
Cha bhean mise do nighean
'S cha dean i mo lochd.' Imhir,
'La Fheill Bride brisgeanach
Thig an ceann de 'n chaiteanach,
Thig nighean Iomhair as an tom
Le fonn feadalaich.'
'Thig an nathair as an toll
La donn Bride,
Ged robh tri traighean dh' an
Air leachd an lair.' t-sneachd
(The Feast Day of the Bride,
The daughter of Ivor shall come from the knoll,
I will not touch the daughter of Ivor,
Nor shall she harm me.
On the Feast Day of Bride,
The head will come off the 'caiteanach,'
The daughter of Ivor will corne from the knoll
With tuneful whistling.
The serpent will come from the hole
On the brown Day of Bride,
Though there should be three feet of snow
On the flat surface of the ground.)
The 'daughter of Ivor' is the serpent; and it is said that the serpent will not sting a descendant of Ivor, he having made 'tabhar agus tuis,' offering and incense, to it, thereby securing immunity from its sting for himself and his seed for ever.
'La Bride nam brig ban
Thig an rigen ran a tom,
Cha bhoin mise ris an rigen ran,
'S cha bhoin an rigen ran rium.'
(On the day of Bride of the white hills
The noble queen will come from the knoll,
I will not molest the noble queen,
Nor will the noble queen molest me.)
More comments:
[This is obviously a carry over of serpent worship among the Irish and Gaels and is remarked as such by Alexander Carnichael in his notes and those presented at the URL.]
12
Another time thereafter she wished to visit her mother who was in slavery in Munster, and her father and fostermother would scarcely allow her to go. She went however. Her mother was at that time in ... engaged in dairy work away from the druid, and she was suffering from a disease of the eye. Brigit was working in her stead, and the druid's charioteer was herding the cattle; and every churning she made, she used to divide the produce into twelve portions with its curds, and the thirteenth portion would be in the middle and that was greater than every other portion. ‘Of what advantage to you deem that to be?’, said the charioteer. ‘Not hard’, said Brigit. ‘I have heard that there were twelve apostles with the Lord, and he himself the thirteenth. I shall have from God that thirteen poor people will come to me one day, the same number as Christ and his apostles.’ ‘And why do you not store up some of the butter?’ said the charioteer, ‘for that is what every dairy-worker does.’ ‘It is difficult for me’, said Brigit, ‘to deprive Christ of his own food.’ Then baskets were brought to her to be filled from the wife of the druid. She had only the butter of one and a half churnings. The baskets were filled with that and the guests, namely the druid and his wife, were satisfied. The druid said to Brigit: ‘The cows shall be yours and let you distribute the butter among the poor, and your mother shall not be in service from today and it shall not be necessary to buy her, and I shall be baptized and I shall never part from you.’ ‘Thanks be to God’, said Brigit.
My comments on this:
[The parallels between the Moons of a year are pretty obvious here as well, especially in the 12/13 portions of the churning of milk (in Vedic myth,this churning is the way in which creation and life began). Brighid is fulfilling her function and giving prosperity while she is doing it, yet nothing is diminished by the action. The roles of master/servant are reversed here with the Druid and Brighid, yet it is obvious that the Druid in the end yields to Sovereignty and Her Prosperity.]
Ibor is also a name for the Yew Tree in Old Irish and Gaelic. As such it is a symbol of recurring rebirth and ongoing life in cycles. In my opinion, Ibor is another name for the Dagda and his daughter the serpent is Brighid, Goddess of Wisdom. The name Ibor can be found as Ibhor, Ibar, Ibhar, Iomhair, and perhaps Iubhar in Irish and Gaelic tales.
There are also parallels between serpents, nagas, nathair, nathracha, and the children of Danu in both Vedic and Irish Celtic mythology. That's a posting for another day however,
-Searles O'Dubhain