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Post by Der Trommler on Sept 11, 2006 19:09:34 GMT -5
I am learning Irish right now but really want to learn Celtic/Gaelic (although, I still want to keep learning Irish!) Anyway, how close are these languages in pronunciation as well as relationship?
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Post by wren on Sept 12, 2006 11:27:44 GMT -5
I am only just beginning to study Scots Gaelic myself. I would love to learn both Scots and Irish Gaelic to better understand the lore, as well as wanting to learn the language of my ancestors. It is my understanding that the two are very similar, enough so to be understood between them. In Scotland, it evolved into 'Scots', a form of Scot's English. Manx, Isle of Man and Welsh languages are quite different. The Grove I attend is Welsh-based and I find no similarities in the terms they use with Gaelic. For example, I believe the concept of 'responsible' translates to modern Irish as freagach. Irish Gaelic would be cú ram and Scots Gaelic would be cu ramach. Welsh would be atebol and Manx freggytagh. (I've taken this from a discussion of Celtic Values by Alexei Kondratiev, which I just happen to be studying right now ) Marcus might be the best person to advice us both...
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Post by Der Trommler on Sept 12, 2006 17:25:25 GMT -5
Cool! Thanks! I wanted to learn Gaelic first but the local library only has Scottish & Irish. I start with Irish first just because I guess! (lol) The book/cassette (yes, cassette!) helps but only with simple words (counting to 19....Naoi Deag) So, as it is helping here & there, I would also like to get more in depth & really learn all three! My great grandmother spoke Gaelic but it never transferred down either to my grandmother or my mother...something that really bugged me as I love traditional rites....
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Post by Marcus on Sept 13, 2006 15:19:07 GMT -5
They are quite different but have their similarites for sure. irish and Scots Gaelic are similar and are more just different dialects i think. Manx though is something i could never grasp lol. The spelling is a nightmare!!! Something you should take into consideration when leanring Irish Gaelic!! There are two different types of Irish Gaelic! The is Munster Irish and then their is Donegal Irish. Both are basically the same language but their are different pronucntiations and spellings. I had spent alot of time learning Irish from a Donegal Irish teacher. My girlfriend is fluent in Irish but she is from the south of Ireland so she speaks Munster Irish!! Trying to keep up with what she is trying to say is a nightmare!!!
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Post by wren on Sept 13, 2006 15:37:23 GMT -5
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Post by Marcus on Sept 14, 2006 11:18:47 GMT -5
Marcus, is Ulster Irish different because of the influx of Scots to that area (when the Irish were forced out and the Scots brought in to 'settle' the area)? So, would it be a bit between Irish and Scots? Perhaps. But the scots Gaelic is still very different.
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Post by Der Trommler on Sept 14, 2006 16:59:29 GMT -5
I've heard of Donegal but I can't remember from where or what it pertains to. Wren, thank you, I will read up on that as well....The issue here is that I've always wanted to learn Gaelic but was never able to. While learning Irish will be fun, I realized that my ties were Scottish as well. From what I've learned so far, my mother's side is 100% Irish (Dublin, I believe). My father's side is from Aberdeen (if memory serves correct)....
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Post by ihrian on Sept 14, 2006 19:56:42 GMT -5
what are u using to learn irish?! i want to learn it soo much...but i'll take one language at a time i think!!
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Post by Der Trommler on Sept 15, 2006 7:32:36 GMT -5
This one is for beginner's (probably for tourists! lol)...It's called Irish for beginners by Passport Books. Goes over things like saying hello, goodbye...counting, asking what something is or to translate to English. But I don't know which dialect it is. I will pick up another one at the library & soon after will start buying some CD/books (the most useful for learning languages aside from having a teacher! I'm going to learn Irish a bit & probably fall into Gaelic but I may go to Scottish & then Gaelic. Not sure, but this why I started the thread!!! lol
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Post by ihrian on Sept 15, 2006 9:08:41 GMT -5
sounds great..so u got urs fromthe library? i'll have to check mine out, lol
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Post by Senbecc on Sept 15, 2006 9:18:22 GMT -5
This one is for beginner's (probably for tourists! lol)...It's called Irish for beginners by Passport Books. Goes over things like saying hello, goodbye...counting, asking what something is or to translate to English. But I don't know which dialect it is. I will pick up another one at the library & soon after will start buying some CD/books (the most useful for learning languages aside from having a teacher! I'm going to learn Irish a bit & probably fall into Gaelic but I may go to Scottish & then Gaelic. Not sure, but this why I started the thread!!! lol The one for tourists is a good start. I have come to consider that Irish gaelic has dialects not unlike those right here in america actually, you have southern English, eastern, northern, etc. One good site (though it's a paid site) is: www.irish-sayings.com/irishblessings.phpAs you can listen to a few for free, and see what you think.
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Post by Marcus on Sept 15, 2006 11:08:20 GMT -5
This one is for beginner's (probably for tourists! lol)...It's called Irish for beginners by Passport Books. Goes over things like saying hello, goodbye...counting, asking what something is or to translate to English. But I don't know which dialect it is. I will pick up another one at the library & soon after will start buying some CD/books (the most useful for learning languages aside from having a teacher! I'm going to learn Irish a bit & probably fall into Gaelic but I may go to Scottish & then Gaelic. Not sure, but this why I started the thread!!! lol Is it one of those books with a tape included? It would be very hard to get the pronuctiations right without hearing the words spoken to you. Most of the Irish you will learn will be Munster Irish. But most of the Irish you hear in the media is Donegal Irish mostly because during the troubles IRA and Republican propaganda was in Donegal Irish. The US media just took that dialect and ignored the other.
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Post by Marcus on Sept 15, 2006 11:12:46 GMT -5
Here are some examples of how the Irish language changes depending in which province you are in. Munster Irish - How are you? - Conas atá tú?Ulster Irish - How are you? - Cad é mar atá tú?Connacht Irish - How are you? - Cé chaoi bhfuil tú?Take a look at this website: You can listen to how different some of the words actually sound: www.irish-sayings.com/irishblessings.php
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Post by wren on Sept 15, 2006 12:34:03 GMT -5
These links are great! Thanks, everyone!
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Post by Der Trommler on Sept 15, 2006 19:11:48 GMT -5
It has a tape but I'd rather have a CD (finding a tape player & rewinding etc..is impossible! lol) I've learned a few things through this: Dia Duit? Conas ata tu? Slan ga foill....(counting & a few others) It has been helping although I'd rather learn in Ireland! lol This one is for beginner's (probably for tourists! lol)...It's called Irish for beginners by Passport Books. Goes over things like saying hello, goodbye...counting, asking what something is or to translate to English. But I don't know which dialect it is. I will pick up another one at the library & soon after will start buying some CD/books (the most useful for learning languages aside from having a teacher! I'm going to learn Irish a bit & probably fall into Gaelic but I may go to Scottish & then Gaelic. Not sure, but this why I started the thread!!! lol Is it one of those books with a tape included? It would be very hard to get the pronuctiations right without hearing the words spoken to you. Most of the Irish you will learn will be Munster Irish. But most of the Irish you hear in the media is Donegal Irish mostly because during the troubles IRA and Republican propaganda was in Donegal Irish. The US media just took that dialect and ignored the other.
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