aj
Thinker
Posts: 68
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Temples
Jul 3, 2007 23:37:17 GMT -5
Post by aj on Jul 3, 2007 23:37:17 GMT -5
well to put it at its simplest I want to take over the world and build a huge city but thats not what this thread is about thats just the back ground. I want to build several huge temples for the gods all of them.
any suggestions ,ideas, designs, sites that have recreations of old temples anything like that would be very helpful thanks .
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Temples
Jul 5, 2007 11:22:55 GMT -5
Post by KittyLane on Jul 5, 2007 11:22:55 GMT -5
So the temples are for your gods or for you when you are a god? (after taking over the world I would presume you would achieve god status)
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aj
Thinker
Posts: 68
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Temples
Jul 5, 2007 16:26:54 GMT -5
Post by aj on Jul 5, 2007 16:26:54 GMT -5
So the temples are for your gods or for you when you are a god? (after taking over the world I would presume you would achieve god status) freedom of religion therefore for ALL gods.
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Finn
Philosopher
Posts: 153
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Temples
Jul 5, 2007 16:33:15 GMT -5
Post by Finn on Jul 5, 2007 16:33:15 GMT -5
well to put it at its simplest I want to take over the world and build a huge city but thats not what this thread is about thats just the back ground. I want to build several huge temples for the gods all of them. any suggestions ,ideas, designs, sites that have recreations of old temples anything like that would be very helpful thanks . Hrm. What would be the point of creating this (or these) Mega Temples to all Gods and Goddesses?
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aj
Thinker
Posts: 68
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Temples
Jul 5, 2007 16:45:27 GMT -5
Post by aj on Jul 5, 2007 16:45:27 GMT -5
well to put it at its simplest I want to take over the world and build a huge city but thats not what this thread is about thats just the back ground. I want to build several huge temples for the gods all of them. any suggestions ,ideas, designs, sites that have recreations of old temples anything like that would be very helpful thanks . Hrm. What would be the point of creating this (or these) Mega Temples to all Gods and Goddesses? have places for pagans if they wanted to do something indoors instead of traveling 400 miles to do something outside. plus its like a pagan church so there arent 50000 churches around. besides it gives me an excuse to commision beautiful buildings and statues
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Finn
Philosopher
Posts: 153
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Temples
Jul 5, 2007 16:53:43 GMT -5
Post by Finn on Jul 5, 2007 16:53:43 GMT -5
have places for pagans if they wanted to do something indoors instead of traveling 400 miles to do something outside. plus its like a pagan church so there arent 50000 churches around. Well, if we are to pursue this "what if" scenario to its logical conclusion... I would have to say Pagans (whatever their stripe) can already do things indoors or outdoors and don't have to travel four feet much less four hundred miles to do so. This would only explain why you want to make "Pagan" Temples, not why you would want to build temples for every God and Goddess period. Of course, this also begs the questions: "Why would you want to deny people their right to have 50,000+ Churches all around. What makes you think creating the Mega-Church will curb anyone's desire to still have all their own Churches where they don't have to share space with other religions they do not believe in?" One can presume, that your "what if" scenario is based on your taking over the world and ENFORCING equality of religions under your power. I'm not sure how this equates to "freedom of religion" as long as it is done on your terms. All in all it sounds like it is the opposite of freedom of religion. Fair enough. But why would you need an "excuse" to commission beautiful buildings and statues to start with? In theory you can do that with or without taking over the world and with our without religious reasons. Moreover, you can do religious ones without the participation of anyone else. So again, I have to ask what the "actual" point of the exercise woudl be?
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aj
Thinker
Posts: 68
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Temples
Jul 5, 2007 18:03:44 GMT -5
Post by aj on Jul 5, 2007 18:03:44 GMT -5
have places for pagans if they wanted to do something indoors instead of traveling 400 miles to do something outside. plus its like a pagan church so there arent 50000 churches around. Well, if we are to pursue this "what if" scenario to its logical conclusion... I would have to say Pagans (whatever their stripe) can already do things indoors or outdoors and don't have to travel four feet much less four hundred miles to do so. This would only explain why you want to make "Pagan" Temples, not why you would want to build temples for every God and Goddess period. Of course, this also begs the questions: "Why would you want to deny people their right to have 50,000+ Churches all around. What makes you think creating the Mega-Church will curb anyone's desire to still have all their own Churches where they don't have to share space with other religions they do not believe in?" One can presume, that your "what if" scenario is based on your taking over the world and ENFORCING equality of religions under your power. I'm not sure how this equates to "freedom of religion" as long as it is done on your terms. All in all it sounds like it is the opposite of freedom of religion. Fair enough. But why would you need an "excuse" to commission beautiful buildings and statues to start with? In theory you can do that with or without taking over the world and with our without religious reasons. Moreover, you can do religious ones without the participation of anyone else. So again, I have to ask what the "actual" point of the exercise woudl be? who said anything about a mega church? I'm gonna set up a few very nice temples churchs and other things. if they want more they can buy the space and build it themselves. you seem to have missed the key letter my friend S templeS. as in plural. not just one big one.
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Finn
Philosopher
Posts: 153
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Temples
Jul 5, 2007 19:28:11 GMT -5
Post by Finn on Jul 5, 2007 19:28:11 GMT -5
who said anything about a mega church? I'm gonna set up a few very nice temples churchs and other things. if they want more they can buy the space and build it themselves. you seem to have missed the key letter my friend S templeS. as in plural. not just one big one. Okay? I still am not clear on the purpose?
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aj
Thinker
Posts: 68
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Post by aj on Jul 6, 2007 0:43:28 GMT -5
who said anything about a mega church? I'm gonna set up a few very nice temples churchs and other things. if they want more they can buy the space and build it themselves. you seem to have missed the key letter my friend S templeS. as in plural. not just one big one. Okay? I still am not clear on the purpose? I dunno I just thought it was a cool idea that we have temples like we used to. also I think part of our problem as pagans is that there isnt a real presence. do everything at home, in the park, stuff like that people think its something bad that you're trying to hide.
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Post by Lady Anastasia on Jul 6, 2007 1:54:40 GMT -5
*smacks AJ upsided the head*
Change your avatar... I keep thinking that stormie posted and it's AJ...
Annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd.... I agree with Finn... If you want to build temples, then, by all means do so..
Just remember... I may be tempted to build mine right across the street... lmao... We'll see who goes to who's temple... hehehe
Ok... Done Joking... I don't think that pagans building huge temples and being more visible to the rest of the world is going to solve anything about the misconceptions that people have about us..
If anything... we'd be giving people a centralized location to... A. Protest B. Try to Shut Down C. Bomb/Burn Down
And... even if Pagan temples were the norm... I think I'd still be more inclined to practice in my own home, or, out in nature the way that I choose to do so..
My path is mine alone, and, it's a private thing for me.. I'd rather not be worshipping with 500 other people, conforming to the way that they wish to do things..
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Post by KittyLane on Jul 6, 2007 8:04:43 GMT -5
I'm with lala. I am more for a private practice in my own home or with the group I love and respect outdoors. But everyone is different. Perhaps a building is what you need or want to worship your gods or goddesses. That is for you to decide.
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Finn
Philosopher
Posts: 153
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Post by Finn on Jul 6, 2007 8:04:57 GMT -5
I dunno I just thought it was a cool idea that we have temples like we used to. Who is "we?" The Pagans of the ancient world, as the Pagans today, were not allied, similiar, or on the same page. They were different religions. Your use of the term "we" implies, for example, that you and I are theologically on the same page. I assure you, this would be a poor assumption on your part. But let's stick with the ancient world for a bit. Who had temples? The Romans were a big one. Pagan Rome loved temples. The bloodly Romans can freeze in Hades for all I care. Genocidal, greedy, parasites who could only maintain their country on the spoils and slaves of an ever expanding empire. It was Pagan Rome that put most of Europe to the sword in its rise. It was Pagan Rome which wrought genocide in Gaul and reduced the Celts to the British Isles. These guys loved building temples in honor of themselves, the Gods they stole from others, or just for kicks. They built temples not to honor the Gods, or for the convenience of others, but to awe and show off. Of course, therein lies the rub. Many temples (if not most) have little to do with worship. I could go on and on. Who says some of us aren't doing something bad? You are a young guy, and somewhat idealistic. Trust me when I say there are bad Wiccans, Pagans, and Heathens. Forget that idiotic notion that there is no devil in the craft. There are Gods and Goddesses under the Pagan Umbrella that make the Christian Satan look like a boy scout. In fact, I'm sure some of my beliefs and practices would seem quite bad, perhaps even evil to you and certainly to Christians. That being said, being polite and private doesn't mean one is "hiding." Why do you think we need a "presence" as you put it? This is a fair question. What is your motive for this desire? Why do you feel we need to be on stage, have an audience, and I presume the acceptance of others? Does the truth of our beliefs somehow depend upon the validation of others? Do you think that our different paradigms will get more acceptance by being pushed head to head with others? If so, explain this logic? None of us like it when the religion of others is danced in front of our face, why would we want to do the same? I am not hiding from anyone. People outside my Order just don't have any bearing on us, so we don't include them. More to the point, they don't deserve the knowledge that we have worked very hard to earn. We aren't giving anything away.
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aj
Thinker
Posts: 68
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Temples
Jul 6, 2007 18:25:09 GMT -5
Post by aj on Jul 6, 2007 18:25:09 GMT -5
all very good points. Ok so maybe my thinking was alittle wrong. but no I wasnt saying we were theologically on the same page. And I by no means believe all of the gods are light and love and all that.
I just thought it'd be cool to have temples like there once were. Yes romans were assholes. But I dont think they built the temples solely to honor themselves and show off. though showing off wouldve been a big part of it.
perhaps I romantisied the idea alittle much. But while I agree we dont need to share things we've worked for hard, nor do we need the judgement of the masses I do think that part of the reason that they believe some of the crap they do is because we're not so out there. While I dont know where you (finn) got the ideas for some of the things you seem to think I'm saying no I dont feel we need to go "head to head" with other religions.
I really like the idea of beautiful temples where a person could honor the gods with others that see things similarly if not exactly the same. you wouldnt have to conform and I got nothing against our practicing in home or outside but I still like the idea. I did not say we were hiding I said that it seems like that to others.
opps. rereading my original post I noticed I forgot to ask opinions on what you all would think of temples, though that seems to have become the main discussion anyway.
p.s. my use of the term "we" meant pagans in general. buddhists, hindus, still have temples and religious places, shinto does too I believe. oh and lala good points but I havent heard of anyone blowing up a buddhist shrine anytime recently.
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Finn
Philosopher
Posts: 153
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Temples
Jul 6, 2007 20:12:44 GMT -5
Post by Finn on Jul 6, 2007 20:12:44 GMT -5
perhaps I romantisied the idea alittle much. But while I agree we dont need to share things we've worked for hard, nor do we need the judgement of the masses I do think that part of the reason that they believe some of the crap they do is because we're not so out there. So by extension of this idea, if we were "out there" more people would believe less of the crap and more of the stuff we believe? I beg to differ. You know (or should) exactly where I got that idea. You just repeated a little further above. The notion is there are a lot of people out there who believe in crap. If we were more out they might believe what we believe. Guess what, that is called "bearing witness" and it means going head to head with opposing theologies. Perhaps. But then again, it depends on if you truly believe that monuments the like of which we mortals contrive impress the Gods and Goddesses. When I look upon mountains, oceans, forests, and the sky itself, I find our trappings rather unimpressive. I find it hard to believe such things are constructed for the entertainment of anyone but ourselves. And by the way, the context of what you wrote reads as if you think we are hiding, and that by that hiding we look guilty to others. You may not have intended it that way, but that is how it reads.
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Temples
Jul 6, 2007 23:46:22 GMT -5
Post by Lady Anastasia on Jul 6, 2007 23:46:22 GMT -5
oh and lala good points but I havent heard of anyone blowing up a buddhist shrine anytime recently. Fortunately for Buddhists, the religion is fairly accepted, But, there are many problems in China, Tibet and other places with religious statues being torn down, etc... look into it And...... CHANGE YOUR AVATAR!
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