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Post by Senbecc on Jul 19, 2007 14:32:38 GMT -5
For those who don't know, this means spanking, paddling, etc. you kids. More and more I think we see the government telling us how to raise our children. Damn...Fate knows I've had my share in my time...*shakes head* Damn have I had my share...I'm wondering what some of the opinions here might be on the subject? Should we or shouldn't we?
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Dystopia
Philosopher
I never found a companion that was so companionable as solitude...
Posts: 124
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Post by Dystopia on Jul 20, 2007 8:58:28 GMT -5
Such an interesting topic. So much to say. I`m a little bit disappointed no one posted anything yet. But I`ll wait up a little bit more and than I`ll state my opinion...
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aj
Thinker
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Post by aj on Jul 20, 2007 14:14:06 GMT -5
only reason no ones posted anything is cause he put this in atleast 5 myspace groups
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Finn
Philosopher
Posts: 153
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Post by Finn on Jul 21, 2007 10:00:24 GMT -5
I don't have any children, so my opinion would be kind of moot. My family used physical punishments when they felt it was called for. I only remember being spanked twice in my life. So clearly either it was an effective punishment when used in moderation, or they simply didn't spank me everytime it was needed.
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Post by Senbecc on Jul 21, 2007 11:32:10 GMT -5
I don't have any children, so my opinion would be kind of moot. My family used physical punishments when they felt it was called for. I only remember being spanked twice in my life. So clearly either it was an effective punishment when used in moderation, or they simply didn't spank me everytime it was needed. LoL Finn, I don't have any living with me, so I'm kind of in the same boat. Even if you don't you can still speak on both your opinion and past experience as a child yourself as you have done. If you had a kid tomorrow what would your personal opinions be?
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Finn
Philosopher
Posts: 153
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Post by Finn on Jul 21, 2007 17:31:06 GMT -5
LoL Finn, I don't have any living with me, so I'm kind of in the same boat. Even if you don't you can still speak on both your opinion and past experience as a child yourself as you have done. If you had a kid tomorrow what would your personal opinions be? My opinion is, colored by my own experience, is that physical punishment should be reserved for those rare times when the act is so serious that you want to make special point. The fear of a spanking is far more effective than regular spankings. Too much punishment would at best simply lose efficacy, at worst condition a child to think social interaction is based on violence. Too much kindness is bad. Too much pain is bad. My family didn't have a lot of punishments, period. They rarely seemed necessary.
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Dystopia
Philosopher
I never found a companion that was so companionable as solitude...
Posts: 124
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Post by Dystopia on Jul 30, 2007 17:59:48 GMT -5
Good Lord, I completely forgot about this thread! (i keep forgetting where i posted and what).
I certainly have no children either, but i don`t think you need one to have an opinion about this, since we were all kids once. As far as I`m concerned, I`m strictly against it, and not just spanking or paddling, but against any kind of physical punishment. I think they`re completely ineffective, and mainly so because they lead in the wrong direction. They seem to push the child not into avoiding to do the thing for which it had been punished, but into avoiding to tell the truth. Kids will more likely lie about where they`ve been and what they were doing, because they`re not sure if they`ll be punished for it. So they`ll more likely lie simply in order to avoid being punished. After being hit children will rarely understand the seriousness of their mistake or that they really deserved it. And the phrase: ..you`ll thank me later in life...rarely works. I`m more for diplomatic way of solving the problem, like talking to children and trying to figure out why they did what they did etc. Parents often underestimate children thinking that they won`t understand the matter, so it`s more easy to punish them by spanking or grounding. I don`t think so. I think they`re pretty much capable of differentiating between right and wrong, if explained correctly.
My brother and I have never been hit or spanked in life and I don`t think there`s anything wrong with us. As a matter of fact I think we`re doing pretty fine. When we were kids we were permitted to do almost everything (as long as it doesn`t harm anyone or ourselves)…and of course :”It`s better I hear it from you then from the neighbors or someone else!” So if we ever told a lie or did something wrong we would be punished, not by paddling, but by a remarkable feeling of shame that wouldn`t go away till we made it right. That disappointed look in my parents` eyes would made me and my bro feel so ashamed of ourselves, knowing that we were given everything and that they were confident in us, and yet we failed them. I can assure you something like that cannot be forgotten that easily. Anyway, I suppose that`s why we have such a great relationship with our parents. I noticed that`s not usually the case with those who were often been spanked. I remember my best friend used to pray to God that her mother would die so she couldn`t punish her anymore. I wouldn`t like my child to think of me in that way. Would you? I don`t know,…whatever the child`s mistake may be, physical punishment just doesn`t seem right. At least it doesn`t to me!
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Dystopia
Philosopher
I never found a companion that was so companionable as solitude...
Posts: 124
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Post by Dystopia on Jul 30, 2007 18:02:07 GMT -5
...and...what about Senbecc`s opinion?
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Post by Der Trommler on Jul 30, 2007 18:15:06 GMT -5
I'll offer up...First, I was raised on not just my parents hitting me but aunts/uncles & the parents of the neighborhood. The fact was, you got a whack on the butt if you did something wrong. I never got hit by the neighbors nor my aunts/uncles. My father threatened the belt on me but never used it ever. My mother did hit us when we deserved it. The amount of force was never too much but gave us something to think about the next time around. As far as I'm concerned, there should be some leeway on this. If used in moderation (never hit out of anger), you can teach right from wrong. Case & point, Illistyl's brother & his wife do not believe in this type of punishment, results? Their kids do so many things wrong, it gets frustrating. Now, there's also the other side of the coin with verbal punishment. That, is also something that, if you yell at your kid, it's abuse. So what happens when the kid does something wrong? How can he/she tell right from wrong? Movies, shows, life (in general) show that there's a lack of emotion & feeling in doing things wrong. Then turn to the video games....What happens is that kids do not understand right from wrong as much anymore & the world is getting more violent & crazy than ever before. I learned something, when crossing the street, look both ways. How did I learn that? By running without looking. I got hit by a car (almost got killed) landed on my head & made a ton of people that saw it talk about it years later. The woman driving the car freaked & took off. Moral? I learned by something that devasting. Every action has an equal an opposite reaction. There are things kids need to learn & fast before they go to school. Then, they learn mcuh more. So, in moderation, I'm for it.
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Post by Senbecc on Aug 17, 2007 3:27:48 GMT -5
...and...what about Senbecc`s opinion? Apologies, I've been pretty busy lately, and haven't had a chance to get back to some of these discussions. My opinion is pretty close to Finn's I think in that it shouldn't be used as often as some do, but more often than others. Pain can be a memorable lesson. I have worked with people who would do stupid things on the job nearly to the point of being walked out the door. Over and over they pull the same thing until one day...BAM it gets em and they find out why people said it was wrong in the first place...Never again after that do they pull it again. I feel corporal punishment should be used if a kid is told to do something and then ignores you, lying, blatant defiance of an adult, and sometimes in safety issues. I also feel that the Christians are on to something with these two saying. First, "spare the rod, spoil the child" and the newer one, "Never in anger."
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Post by Der Trommler on Aug 17, 2007 23:00:18 GMT -5
...and...what about Senbecc`s opinion? Apologies, I've been pretty busy lately, and haven't had a chance to get back to some of these discussions. My opinion is pretty close to Finn's I think in that it shouldn't be used as often as some do, but more often than others. Pain can be a memorable lesson. I have worked with people who would do stupid things on the job nearly to the point of being walked out the door. Over and over they pull the same thing until one day...BAM it gets em and they find out why people said it was wrong in the first place...Never again after that do they pull it again. I feel corporal punishment should be used if a kid is told to do something and then ignores you, lying, blatant defiance of an adult, and sometimes in safety issues. I also feel that the Christians are on to something with these two saying. First, "spare the rod, spoil the child" and the newer one, "Never in anger." I honestly was never spanked with anything other than a hand & even then it was only a few hits. I learned quickly that it hurt & to do what I was told. My father threatened to use the belt but that damn thing only got partially out from the loop of his pants & I stopped. So, I'm for it...again, in moderation. But as John said...never in anger.....
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Post by Senbecc on Aug 19, 2007 5:13:44 GMT -5
Apologies, I've been pretty busy lately, and haven't had a chance to get back to some of these discussions. My opinion is pretty close to Finn's I think in that it shouldn't be used as often as some do, but more often than others. Pain can be a memorable lesson. I have worked with people who would do stupid things on the job nearly to the point of being walked out the door. Over and over they pull the same thing until one day...BAM it gets em and they find out why people said it was wrong in the first place...Never again after that do they pull it again. I feel corporal punishment should be used if a kid is told to do something and then ignores you, lying, blatant defiance of an adult, and sometimes in safety issues. I also feel that the Christians are on to something with these two saying. First, "spare the rod, spoil the child" and the newer one, "Never in anger." I honestly was never spanked with anything other than a hand & even then it was only a few hits. I learned quickly that it hurt & to do what I was told. My father threatened to use the belt but that damn thing only got partially out from the loop of his pants & I stopped. So, I'm for it...again, in moderation. But as John said...never in anger.....Oh...I can't even begin to say what all I got it with. Switches, belts, the hand, you name it. My granny would make us go get our own switch, and we best come back with the right one...LoL!
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Post by KittyLane on Aug 19, 2007 23:00:28 GMT -5
Well I do have children. Two very active boys. I do use corporal punishment in a sense. I threaten more than I actually go through with it. I use time outs and the reward system. It works really well for me. My oldest reacts the strongest when he thinks he is going to be put into time out. When he is actually put in time out, his whole world is at a end. We talk about what he did wrong and about NOT doing it again. (it usually does throughout the course of the day...)
I feel that spanking is sometimes necessary. However spanking out of anger, or during a bad situation is just asking for trouble. You cannot say for 100% certain that you can completely control that situation. You cannot say that you will not hit too hard. Plus there is another factor that gets left out here: the humiliation. I was spanked growing up, switches and belts. I was made to go and pick out my own switch for my punishment. If it was not knobby enough I had to go back and get another one. Mortified is what I was. Then I grew resentful of my parents for doing that to me.
So I feel nothing is ever gained from this type of punishment. No lessons learned. Some say the down fall of society is to blame for parents not punishing their children. What is not realized here is parents do have to punish, just in different and consistent ways.
Respect is also something that must be instilled into children. It has to be taught, and you have to respect your children too. They are people like everyone else. Just in smaller packages...
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niamh
Philosopher
Posts: 242
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Post by niamh on Aug 22, 2007 16:53:10 GMT -5
to be honest i think verbel abuse and just plain old shouting at a child is complelty wrong i dont care what theyl done... id perfer a spanking (as long as it wasnt aggresive)ahead of shouting any day. i was spanked (but not that offen by my father)..i repected him for it...the only bad outcome is that it affected him far more then it ever could with me as a result he hasnt been comfrotable enough around me to even slightly touch me in any way since i was 10...i actually havent touched his bare skin since then
spanking should not be the first thing you think of but i dont think it should be completly dismissed as being a bad thing but i do think that shouting and verbel abuse is far worse and should never be used on a child but i think alot of ppl would prob disagree with me on that
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Post by Der Trommler on Aug 22, 2007 22:31:36 GMT -5
to be honest i think verbel abuse and just plain old shouting at a child is complelty wrong i dont care what theyl done... id perfer a spanking (as long as it wasnt aggresive)ahead of shouting any day. i was spanked (but not that offen by my father)..i repected him for it...the only bad outcome is that it affected him far more then it ever could with me as a result he hasnt been comfrotable enough around me to even slightly touch me in any way since i was 10...i actually havent touched his bare skin since then spanking should not be the first thing you think of but i dont think it should be completly dismissed as being a bad thing but i do think that shouting and verbel abuse is far worse and should never be used on a child but i think alot of ppl would prob disagree with me on that I am the son of an alcoholic mother. I don't know much about her in her non-inebriated state but I went through a lot of mental hell in my life. It set me apart from people. As a result, I am not as much a warm person (in person) as I'd like to be. I don't know how to react around drunk people unless, I myself, am inebriated as well. Anyway, I agree with you here. Mental cruelty does a hell of a lot more damage than physical although, sometimes can come into play at the same time. Again, never hit out of anger, it is a teaching tool. I mean, if my son/daughter bit me or someone else, I'd bite them back. I wouldn't try to break skin. I'd want to let them know what it feels like so the next time, they know that they are hurting someone & it's not nice.
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