|
Post by Der Trommler on Feb 10, 2007 18:30:39 GMT -5
You may be right about that....the depictions all over the world seem to show that they very well may have
|
|
|
Post by tanath on Feb 11, 2007 19:15:18 GMT -5
stories weren't recorded until long after writing became reletively common. they saw no need to write down something everyone already knew. over time they changed and were added to and taken from and combined with other stories. there's no way to trace back to the original, if in fact there was one.
art is more reliable. art from all over the world and from all across history shows creatures that can only be interpretted as some form of dragon or lizard monster.
another interesting piece of info. evidence shows that similar advancements and discovers were made in the americas at reletively the same time as in parts of europe, asia, and africa. trading can't account for that.
|
|
|
Post by Senbecc on Feb 11, 2007 19:57:49 GMT -5
there are some pretty scary furry critters out there. just look as panthers and bears. most cultures don't see the serpent as evil or bad. in most cultures they are elegant and honorable. in many cultures they are symbols of rebirth and balance. i think christianity played the biggest part in making the serpent a hated animal. it spread that view everywhere it went and it became the common wayof seeing things. Yeah, the whole Adam & Eve thing gave everyone a complex on serpents!!! Would explain why the Europeans had tales of dragons. How about Celtic Mythoi? Is there any depiction of dragons in there? I wonder....I need to do some research now! The serpent has always been a creepy crawly type. Some cultures warm up to snakes to conquer a fear of the unknown. In Judaism for example the snake wasn't necessarily evil, as much as it was symbolic of the unknown as opposed to the apple which seemed to symbolize a journey from innocence through knowledge. In most cultures the serpent is seen as hidden from view, like the shadows of the mind, sometimes feared, sometimes sacred, however all seem to see it as the shadows of the unknown and the unknown is almost always something to be feared until it is embraced.
|
|
|
Post by tanath on Feb 11, 2007 22:58:45 GMT -5
it's always been creepy, crawly, but not always feared. soem cultures revere them without fearing them. all respect them, with or without the fear, because they are so different from people and can attack without warning or noticable cause.
|
|
|
Post by Der Trommler on Feb 12, 2007 8:57:21 GMT -5
it's always been creepy, crawly, but not always feared. soem cultures revere them without fearing them. all respect them, with or without the fear, because they are so different from people and can attack without warning or noticable cause. This is true....I'm trying to remember something about one culture & the venom of a snake but I can't remember it right now.
|
|
|
Post by tanath on Feb 12, 2007 15:03:04 GMT -5
many cultures see them as good luck and a sign of rebirth. take the oroborus. it was once a greatly revered symbol. some cultures even saw the world as being on the back of a snake or within it's coils.
|
|
|
Post by Der Trommler on Feb 13, 2007 22:27:24 GMT -5
I haven't come across that.....Would you happen to remember one of those cultures?
|
|
|
Post by tanath on Feb 14, 2007 1:07:51 GMT -5
not off-hand but i can try to find it. i'll go do that right now.
i've done a lot of reading of myths from all over the world, but i'm really bad with names. i can remember the stories, just not where they're from.
|
|
|
Post by tanath on Feb 14, 2007 1:39:47 GMT -5
ok, i've found a couple stories. they're not exact, but they're close enough to explain what i was remembering. "The Midgard Serpent The Midgard serpent of Norse mythology (aka Jormangund) was one of the monstrous children of the God Loki and the giantess Angraboda. This giant snake encircles the world of Midgard, holding its tail in its mouth. According to Norse myth, the great battle of Ragnorok will bring about the end of the world. During this apocolypse, Jormangund will leave the ocean and joins the fighting. Thor does eventually kill the serpent, but Jormangund's venom is potent and Thor dies as well." "Ourorboros The symbol of a circled snake devouring its own tail is not unique to any one religion or culture. The term 'ourorboros' comes from the Greek for 'tail eater', but this image is seen in various other myths as well. The Midgard Serpent was pictured this way as well. The symbol may not represent a specific mythos, but does symbolize the endless circle of time, regeneration and harmony. " paganwiccan.about.com/cs/animals/a/snakes.htm________________________________________________________________________ "Even before the Sumerian legends we can find vases with a gigantic snake winding over the whole universe, or over the sun, moon and stars." "Early Sumerian and Akkadian artifacts show pictures of a tree or pole which is called the "axis mundi ", or the world axis. It is intended to be the center and support of the world. Guarding this tree or pole is a snake or pair of intertwined snakes. " "There exists a lovely Elamite painted bowl which shows the guardian serpent of the World tree coiled up the trunk. There are clear similarities to the divine Sumerian or Akkadian serpent. " "In Dahomey, the Fon people have a great serpent god who is seen as a rainbow named Danh, the son of Mtawu-Lisa.. This serpent encircles the whole world with his tail in his mouth, representing unity and wholeness. This god, also called Da orders the whole cosmos. Da has a dual nature rather than a female-male identity. When he appears in the rainbow, the male is the red part of the rainbow, the female the blue. Above the earth Da has 3500 coils, called asa-xasa, and the sme number of coils beneath the earth; together the support the world. Da is the name given to this god in action, Mawu-Lisa is the name given the god in thought. This god was exported to Haiti and Surinam." "The most famous divine serpent in Viking or Norse mythology was Jormungand, the son of Loki. Loki was the closest thing the Teutons have to a Satan. The Vikings imagined the world completely surrounded and supported by the Great Divine World Serpent, Jormungand . There is another serpent, Nidhogg, one of the serpents at the base of the world-tree, who will devour the bones of the whole fallen humanity." www.geocities.com/Athens/Delphi/5789/serpent.htm______________________________________________________________________ this isn't completely relevent to this subject but i like it anyway. i live in ohio and there are two mound sites in my town. " Easily one of the strangest and most unearthly Native American sites in North America is the incredible Serpent Mound in the Amish country of southern Ohio. Possibly constructed by the Adena culture around 700 BCE, Serpent Mound is a narrow band of earth which uncoils over a quarter mile expanse atop a wooded hill. This mound appears, from above, to be a snake ready to swallow a frog. A snake skeleton enshrined leaves little doubt that the mound is meant to be the replica of a snake- the creature of mythic proportions to these early mound builders, as well as indigenous people across the Americas. This is one of the "effigy" mounds in Ohio. It lies on a plateau overlooking the Valley of Brush Creek, Ohio." www.geocities.com/Athens/Delphi/5789/serpent.htm
|
|
|
Post by Der Trommler on Feb 14, 2007 9:02:06 GMT -5
That's awesome!!! Thank you for bringing these subjects! I love the mound....
|
|
|
Post by tanath on Feb 14, 2007 16:36:44 GMT -5
we have the circle mound and octagon mound in my hometown. the circle mound is a state park and the octagon mound is a golf course. sadly, most of the the earthwork structures were destroyed during the building of the city. the circle that's still there is right next to what appears to be water or some sort. for anyone's who's interested you can read more about the mounds here. www.octagonmoonrise.org/WhatAREne.html
|
|
|
Post by Der Trommler on Feb 14, 2007 22:15:57 GMT -5
This is awesome! Thank you so much!
|
|
|
Post by tanath on Feb 14, 2007 23:38:00 GMT -5
you're welcome. i forget that even though i grew up around the mounds very few people know about them. they've become a thing of routine for me. they've always been there and i spent my childhood going on fieldtrips to learn about them. it's nice to be able to share them with people that don't knwo about them. it makes me remember what was so fascinating about them as a child.
|
|
|
Post by Der Trommler on Feb 16, 2007 8:08:17 GMT -5
It is awesome when you can do something like that....Live through someones else's eyes or through a child's eyes. It does seem to give your memories a nice warm fuzzy feeling!!!!
|
|
|
Post by tanath on Feb 16, 2007 17:10:01 GMT -5
it reminds me that although we don't have anythign as glamorous as stonehenge there are things near me that have it's beauty, mystery, and majesty.
|
|